Derek: 00:06

Welcome back to the Fourth Way podcast. This episode we are taking a look at what I think are some of the best resources for you to begin or extend your research on non violence. This should be a a fairly short episode and if you have taken a look at all of the resources linked in each of the podcasts that we've made so far, then you've probably seen every one of these resources. However, I'm hoping here I can organize them and, highlight what I think some of the best are and maybe how how you should begin and in what order you should do this. So let's just dive right in.

Derek: 00:44

So to begin with, if you are new to the idea of Christian nonviolence, I would say that you should start with The Politics of Jesus by John Howard Yoder. And there's another book that's fairly similar to it called the upside down kingdom by Donald Kraybill. The politics of Jesus can be a little bit more complex, and and the upside down kingdom is probably a bit easier, to digest. But here's why I'd suggest the politics of Jesus if you can if you can manage it. First of all, it helps you with a lot of presuppositions.

Derek: 01:19

There are a lot of presuppositions I didn't realize I had, which is why they're presuppositions, where I was just reading Christ a particular way from tradition rather than, really being able to see the big picture. And Yoder expands the person of Jesus from just this guy who's here and we get a glimpse of 3 years of his life just so he could go die on a cross to somebody whose life is much more broad than that, whose teachings are are actually radical and crazy and illicit. You when Yoda pointed that out, I probably had the same responses that his disciples had or the Pharisees had for, like, the first time in my life. Because Jesus' teachings were always turned into metaphor and, not super applicable for me, especially the hard teachings. And Yoder really makes Christ's words as radical as they would have been to to his early hearers.

Derek: 02:24

It also helps to approach the Bible, and to be consistent and honest. It helps you to recognize where you might be making things into metaphor when you shouldn't be. And usually that's out of self interest so that we don't have to follow the hard teachings. And, it it provides a important foundation for nonviolence. If we're gonna make everything a metaphor and if we're gonna be really dismissive of, the prescriptive nature of Christ for us, it's gonna be hard to to really move further into the nonviolent discussion as a Christian.

Derek: 03:00

And Yoder helps to to take that away. Yoder has a lot of other good books. I I mean, everything I've read from him is really good. And I would recommend, just about anything from him. But specifically for Christian nonviolence, I'd start with the politics of Jesus.

Derek: 03:18

As far as the upside down kingdom, it's easier than Yoder, and it, it provides more historical context in some regards that's really interesting and insightful. And it's it has more specific application. But Yoder's book, again, if you can manage it, is going to really dig down, philosophically and and hermeneutically and, be more worth your while, I think, if you can manage it. 2nd book I'd recommend is Fight by Preston Sprinkle. And Fight is going to, move beyond Yoder.

Derek: 03:57

Yoder is focused mostly on Jesus specifically. And fight is going to be the first look you're gonna get at a nonviolent case. So the upside down kingdom and the politics of Jesus are really laying a foundation. Fight is going to give you an overview of the nonviolent case. And it's it's pretty standard theology, from a conservative perspective.

Derek: 04:23

I mean, there wasn't anything that I I saw where I was like, Oh, that's kinda weird. It was interesting, but there was nothing like, unorthodox that stuck out to me. So I think it's a pretty good first read. It goes from old testament, to revelation. And it's it's a really engaging book.

Derek: 04:43

And Preston Sprinkle is also a pretty cool guy. He's got, a lot of, he he does a lot of work with, the downtrodden communities that we have in conservative evangelical circles. He works with, you know, LGBTQ people. He does not, support homosexual, lifestyle, but he treats those individuals like human beings with love. And he's got a great great inroads into that community and has great contacts.

Derek: 05:18

And, he just really works with with people that evangelicals have washed their hands of. And so he's a pretty cool guy. Number 3 is Cross Vision by Greg Boyd. Now, once you start getting here with Greg Boyd, you're getting something that's gonna be a bit less orthodox. He's gonna have some some views that if he grew up in a conservative church are going to be very different.

Derek: 05:48

And I can't exactly vouch for cross vision. I've read the the much lengthier, I don't know. I can't think of Crucifixion of the Warrior God. So supposedly, cross vision is just a condensed version of that. So I assume it's gonna be as good as the Crucifixion of the Warrior God.

Derek: 06:07

And if it is, even though Boyd is unorthodox in some things, he provides a very good rationale for what he argues. And even if you don't believe, all of the things that Boyd puts forward, even if you don't agree with his conclusion from the evidence, he makes he makes a good case and it's it's worth reading. If you're not from a conservative background, it's probably not gonna be any problem for you whatsoever. But, I I strongly recommend it even if you're from a conservative background just to kind of see the range of possibilities and and hear what other people are saying. Boyd is going to dig a lot deeper into the old testament, which is good because that's usually where a lot of people have the the biggest struggle.

Derek: 06:56

And what I specifically like about Boyd is that he adheres to a cruciform theology. And what that means is that, you know, he argues that Christ is the pure revelation of God. Hebrews shows us that. Jesus says that when you see me, you've seen the father. And so Boyd is gonna say, if it doesn't look like Christ, it's not right.

Derek: 07:17

And that's kind of the lens that he uses to look at the Old Testament. And I think that's that's an important thing to consider and a good thing to look at. Resource 4th resource, The Early Church on Killing. So, by Ronald Sider. So So once you once you kind of have an overview of the case for, the case for nonviolence, this Early Church on Killing is going to extend, your understanding by taking a look at okay.

Derek: 07:48

I I've seen the Bible in fight and cross vision. I've kind of seen how how you can make a biblical argument. But what about the historical argument? And the early church on killing is going to go through. It creates a comprehensive, section of quotes with sources.

Derek: 08:07

And I like that Sider explains things too. So he'll say, you know, here's what some people say about this source. Here's some rebuttals. Here's what I think. You know?

Derek: 08:18

And and he gives you kind of weights. Like, you know, we can be pretty sure about this or, well, we're not so sure about this. He does a really good job of, I feel like, being pretty, pretty unbiased, pretty neutral. Resource number 5, Tim Mackey. So Tim Mackey has resource, lots of resources, great podcasts.

Derek: 08:43

I'd recommend them all. But one specific one is on the day of the Lord. And I love how Mackie is is really down to earth. And in this episode, he is able to just explain, some of the ideas of the wrath of God and the violence of God and what what that might entail. So this is getting more specifically or more into specific sorts of arguments and rebuttals.

Derek: 09:08

But Mac is a good resource overall, for this. But he doesn't specifically talk about nonviolence too much other than this Day of the Lord podcast. There are other really good podcasts, some of which do have individual episodes dedicated to nonviolence. Unbelievable is an unbelievable podcast. It, it it's awesome because it usually brings people of opposing views together, and they cordially discuss things somehow.

Derek: 09:39

And that's really awesome to see people of differing viewpoints get together and just talk things out. And I know they have some episodes on nonviolence, at least one. And the Christian humanist also has a pretty good episode on nonviolence. So that's that's where I would start. Now, if you wanna get a bit more advanced, I would recommend the crucifixion of the warrior God by Greg Boyd, which is more complex than cross vision.

Derek: 10:10

It is like a 1,000 pages. It's it's extremely comprehensive, but it's very good. And Boyd spends the first half of his book just opposing the, the normal view. And even if you don't want to become nonviolent, even if you're like, and I'm I'm convinced that that's not true, I would recommend Boyd's book. Just read the first half of it and evaluate your own position and bolster it.

Derek: 10:41

Because Boyd just is relentless in his assault on on the, the common reading. And he he highlights a number of things that I've just always assumed, and I realized, oh, man. I don't know. I don't know that I can adhere to that anymore because I don't know why I believe what I believe. So it's it's made me go back and, really do a lot of homework on peripheral beliefs.

Derek: 11:14

And one way in particular is Boyd pushes back on what he believes is Greek Greek syncretism in, some of the early church teachings and the church fathers, and then and how people have interpreted the New Testament. And and that was really just intriguing. Resource 2, I would recommend just about anything by Stanley Hauerwas. Some things are going to relate more to non violence than others, but, Hauerwas just in general is going to write about more like Christian life and thought. And even though some things aren't explicitly nonviolence, just his his advocacy is going to clearly be based in nonviolence and this just, this love of others in this community.

Derek: 12:03

So what he has to say is is getting a lot more into, like, this positive justice sort of thing where we, where we evaluate how we live. He does have, let's see. One book is called War and the American Difference, An article called Telling the Truth About the Sacrifices of War, The Case for Christian Realism. I mean, he's got tons of stuff, articles and books. A lot of the articles you can find for free.

Derek: 12:30

But Harawas is just spot on and amazing. And he he is so perceptive at pulling out some of our syncretism in the the United States, especially revolving around politics and war. 3rd resource called The Anatomy of a Hybrid by Leonard Verduin. And maybe out of out of all of the resources, I might recommend this the most, particularly if you are going to be focused more on the political aspect. If you're focused on, how violence relates to politics and how we should incorporate that.

Derek: 13:12

The anatomy of a hybrid is just so fascinating in tracing the the history of how Christians have used politics and how, mingling with the political realm has been extremely problematic for Christianity. So if if you're not quite as concerned so much with with war, but you are concerned with the political aspects, the political implications of nonviolence, The Anatomy of a Hybrid is a a really good read. Number 4 and and 5. Number 4. Why Civil Resistance Works.

Derek: 13:48

And number 5. Anything by Gene Sharp. These are going to explore more of the empirical ideas of how nonviolence has objectively worked in the world, as well as why it works. They're going to explore the nature of nonviolence, how non violence can actually be effective, why is it effective, how does it end up restoring things. It's gonna look at the practical nature of non violence.

Derek: 14:19

As far as some extras, we've got a discord discussion group. And I like that group because it's filled with lots of people from lots of different viewpoints. I mean, people who believe all sorts of things. Christian and non Christian. Mostly Christians.

Derek: 14:35

But it's a a good place to go and and get resources and encouragement and, just ask questions. Another one would be the early church writings, especially, taking a look at, people like, from the first 2 or 300 years, Origen, Tertullian, etcetera. Reading some of their works would be helpful to get to get words directly from the horse's mouth rather than what people say about them. You could also look up biographies of non violent individuals. That, I haven't read any, but, doing that might be able to give you some insight into some of their lives.

Derek: 15:24

And, lastly, I'd recommend reading some books on moral injury. And even though moral injury doesn't prove non violence per se, it's something that, a lot of people are recognizing is really important. Moral injury is specifically the the trauma that individuals experience, from killing people. And why it discusses why so many soldiers, even soldiers who haven't, had their lives severely in danger or haven't experienced huge trauma, why they can have, this this traumatic stress. And so that if you're particularly interested in war and the effects that that killing has on people, looking up things on moral injury.

Derek: 16:11

Books like On Killing don't specifically discuss moral injury but kind of set the groundwork for that. And, I mean, if you just type in moral injury you're gonna get lots of books that come up. And I have especially found the books which, which give soldiers, testimonies. I found those the most interesting because you hear it straight from the soldiers instead of a psychologist. And those have been moving and interesting.

Derek: 16:40

Tons of other resources I could recommend, but I will stop it there. Again, if you need any ideas for more resources, I strongly recommend you go to the Discord discussion group and they will hook you up with, a list of resources so long you'd need lifetimes to complete it. But they can they can help to, gear you in for whatever your specific track is. Whatever it is that you're you're interested in. Whether it's the political aspect, whether it's the, the soldiering and moral injury aspects, they can they can hook you up.

Derek: 17:18

So, that's all for now I guess. Oh, peace since I'm a pacifist.